Tammy Baldwin, Eric Hovde get personal during sole US Senate debate

Democratic U.S. Sen. Tammy Baldwin and Republican challenger Eric Hovde sparred over health care, immigration, abortion, the economy and their personal lives in their first and only debate before the Nov. 5 election. Throughout the exchange, both candidates accused one another of lying.

The one-hour debate hosted by the Wisconsin Broadcasters Association covered a wide range of issues and generated tense moments between the two candidates, who have inundated Wisconsin airwaves with attack ads against one another.

Health care

The first series of questions for Baldwin and Hovde focused on health care and prescription drug costs. Asked whether there should be changes to the Affordable Care Act, Hovde said the 2010 law has failed to bring down health care costs and increase access. He said the only “meaningful” part of the law was the prohibitions on insurance companies denying coverage for people who have preexisting conditions.

“Look, I have multiple sclerosis, so I understand the importance of that, but we need a significant restructuring of our health care system,” Hovde said.

Baldwin touted being on a panel of federal lawmakers who helped write the ACA, including her signature provision, which allows young adults to stay on their parents’ insurance plans until they turn 26. She used part of her answer to lob the first attack of the evening, that Hovde has said he would overturn the law entirely.

Abortion 

When the debate turned to the issue of abortion, the candidates were asked whether they would support restoring federal abortion protections that existed before Roe v. Wade was struck down by the U.S. Supreme Court two years ago. Baldwin said “a woman’s rights and freedoms should not depend on her ZIP code and state.” She also referenced a 2012 comment from Hovde stating that he is totally opposed to abortion.

“I’m trying to lead the way to restore Roe so that we don’t see prosecution of women who have miscarried or doctors who are providing health care,” said Baldwin. “Women are dying because of the current situation.”

Hovde said that since the task of regulating abortion services has gone back to the states, Wisconsin “should resolve this in a commonsense and compassionate approach.” He also described his personal views.

“I believe that women should have a right to choose early on in their pregnancy, but there comes a point in time where a baby can be born healthy and alive, and I think it’s unconscionable to terminate that child’s life,” Hovde said.

Hovde then attacked Baldwin by claiming that “you have passed or pushed to allow abortion to happen up to the point of delivery, where a baby can be born alive and be terminated.”

“To me, that is unconscionable,” Hovde said. “You’re shaking your head, but please, what month would you stop? Is it the eighth month? Is it the ninth month? And you run these ads saying I’m for national abortion ban. I am not for a national abortion ban.”

Baldwin shot back.

“That does not happen in America, and it’s very clear that he has never read Roe v. Wade,” Baldwin said.

Immigration

Hovde and Baldwin were asked about a bipartisan immigration bill that Republicans held up in the Senate earlier this year, and whether they would support seeing the bill revived. Hovde said the bill was “dead on arrival” in the GOP-controlled U.S. House of Representatives and was “masquerading as a border bill” while really directing funding to Ukraine.

“It wasn’t going to change any of the asylum laws or immigration laws at all,” Hovde said.

Hovde blamed an influx of illegal border crossings on President Joe Biden, who lifted executive orders issued by former President Donald Trump.

Baldwin called the failed immigration bill “the toughest border bill that we’ve seen in years.”

“It would have added 1,500 new border patrol agents to our southern border, and had it passed in this spring, they would be there now,” Baldwin said.

She then claimed Trump and Hovde wanted the bill to fail because “they wanted the political issue. They wanted the chaos. They didn’t want a solution.”

Social Security 

After referencing statistics from the U.S. Social Security Administration suggesting that federal benefits will be reduced by 20 percent by 2035 if Congress doesn’t take action, Baldwin and Hovde were asked for their own plans.

Baldwin said the solvency of the program can be extended by making “multimillionaires like my opponent” pay their “fair share.” Baldwin then attacked Hovde by claiming that he wants to reduce federal spending levels to those from a decade ago, while supporting tax cuts for corporations and wealthy individuals.

Hovde responded by turning to Baldwin and telling her “the one thing you have perfected in Washington is your ability to lie.”

“I can’t even believe you have the ability to stand here and say something like that,” Hovde said.

He continued with his attack by saying the potential insolvency of Social Security is due to a sharp increase in the national debt.

“If we would have kept Social Security in a trust and not pilfered from it like you have for the last 26 years as a politician, Social Security would be in a much better place,” Hovde said. “So, we have to look at things for Social Security like for those younger people, because life expectancy is going up, to make adjustments for that.”

Recently, Hovde has called for cutting the federal budget to 2019 levels and raising the age for receiving Social Security benefits for those under 40 years old.

US support for Israel, Ukraine

On foreign policy, the candidates were asked about whether the U.S. should continue sending military and financial aid to back Israel in its war against Hamas, and Ukraine in its war against Russia.

Hovde started by saying if America was attacked by a neighboring nation, “we would go wage war on that country, if it happened in Mexico or in Canada” while stating it’s wrong for the Biden administration to tell Israel how to wage war. He also attacked Baldwin for supporting former President Barack Obama’s decision to lift sanctions and give cash payments to Iran, which he said is backing Hamas.

Baldwin said Israel “has the right to defend itself” in the wake of Hamas’s Oct. 7, 2023 attack, “but we’ve also seen untold civilian casualties.” She said the U.S. must support a path toward a ceasefire in the war and eventually “a two-state solution in the region.”

When asked if the U.S. should continue to support for Ukraine, Hovde claimed the Russian invasion two years ago was the result of how Biden withdrew from Afghanistan in 2021.

“Sadly, what’s happening in Ukraine is we’re wiping out generations of their people and turning a lot of their cities into rubble,” Hovde said. “And while I was supportive of Ukraine at first, the amounts of tens of billions of dollars that have gone to Ukraine that are not accountable causes great concern for me. So I don’t think we should continue to fund endlessly money into the Ukraine.”

Baldwin said she “strongly” supports backing Ukraine.

“This is really literally about democracy versus dictatorship,” Baldwin said. “Because of those brave soldiers in Ukraine, we don’t have any boots on the ground in the region.

“Had we not supported Ukraine,” Baldwin continued, “where’s Russia going next? Poland? We have to stand on the side of democracy.”

US Supreme Court reforms

During an apparent moment of agreement, both Hovde and Baldwin said members of the U.S. Supreme Court should have a binding code of ethics and hinted at support for term limits for justices, who now serve lifetime terms. But the exchange turned quickly heated. 

Hovde said he doesn’t think justices should be engaging “in any kind of private investment in the stock market while they serve in that capacity” and then accused Baldwin of having a conflict of interest for not reporting investments made by her partner.

“Her partner on Wall Street, a Wall Street executive, is investing in big tech and Big Pharma, a committee she oversees, and they don’t disclose those investments and how much they’re profiting from it,” Hovde said. “That’s fundamentally wrong, and you should disclose what investment your partner is making.”

Because Baldwin and her partner are not married, Senate rules don’t require the disclosure.

“Eric Hovde should stay out of my personal life,” Baldwin responded. “And I think I speak for most Wisconsin women that he should stay out of all of our personal lives.”

Baldwin called stories about conservative Justice Clarence Thomas accepting lavish gifts from billionaire Republican donor Harlan Crow “outrageous.” She said the court needs a “binding, tough standard of ethics code.”

“We’re also very distrustful now of the court, because we saw three Trump appointed nominees lie to the judiciary committee about their respect for precedent,” Baldwin said. “So I think an examination of term limits for the Supreme Court in a way that doesn’t advantage one party or the other, because we don’t know who will be president when those term limits come up.”